Well, can you tell me your name in drag and out of drag?
My name in drag is Cunning Stunt, like stunning, ooh!, don’t say it!
And my name out of drag is Rose.
And how old are you?
30.
And what pronouns should I be using to refer to you in drag and out of drag?
In drag is he/him, out of drag is he/they.
Can you start off by telling me a little bit about Cunning Stunt? How would you describe your drag persona and how did Cunning Stunt come to be?
Cunning is a sexy, sleazy rock star. I like to describe him as the man your mother warned you about. I’ve been doing drag for three years. I started off doing what I thought was critiques of really traditional masculine roles. Boxers and truck drivers. And after doing more and more shows, this very sparkly, kind of sexually fluid rock star guy came out.
Okay, amazing.
I think it’s maybe my affinity for sparkles and rhinestones that made that happen. But yeah, that’s sort of the history of where you come from.
Do you remember your first performance?
I do, yeah. It’s actually so funny you should ask that. I did, Fordham University, I did a show there yesterday and we ended up doing a panel discussion afterwards. It was the second time in 24 hours somebody asked me this question. My very first drag performance was actually at a drag game night. It wasn’t just bingo, but it was like audience members had to come up and play a game on stage. They would have four newer drag artists perform in between the games. And I did a song called ‘Teach Me, Tiger’. And I had Tiger boxers.
It’s a pretty old song, it’s from the 50s.
And my best friend crocheted me, you know what a packer is, right?
So she crocheted me a packer. And I sewed a little felt tiger onto the tip of it. I also did not start drag in the US. I started drag when I was living in Taipei, Taiwan.
Was that your first performance as Cunning or your first performance in drag?
Both. I’ve never had another persona. This guy just took over my life over the last three years.
I like to call him the man that takes all of my money and space in my apartment. I’ve heard that from other performers too. He really… he does not pay… I mean, he does pay rent. But he takes up a lot of my time and money and he dresses far better than I do. And we are definitely not the same person. It’s not like some people. They think their drag is an extension of themselves. Cunning is for sure a character that I play.
Is it very disconnected or are there elements of you in him?
Maybe elements of myself. Yeah. But not…
Has performing as Cunning changed how you are outside of drag?It’s changed my social life quite a bit for sure. So in that way, yes. Drag is my entire social life. Everything revolves around it. So that has definitely changed my life out of drag.
Are you asking if it’s made me more confident or…?
Yeah, if it’s changed how you…
Not really. No, I was always really loud and confident and annoying.
What’s your favorite part of drag and your least favorite part of drag?
My favorite part of drag… You know, it might be this feeling when you work really, really hard. And you sort of have your head down and you’re just powering through. And then you look back at maybe the last four or six months and you go, “Oh, wow, I’ve really achieved a lot in the last couple months. This is really working for me.” And that self-doubt sort of melts away. And that feels good.
My least favorite part of drag, I really don’t love competing. I’ve done a lot of drag competitions. And I’ve lost every single competition I’ve ever been a part of.
And they got me a lot of bookings. They got me a lot of great references and professional relationships. But I never won. And really make you feel like your drag is bad. And then the comparison. You look at other people’s drag who you really like.
And you start to feel, oh, am I not as good as them? Or do they have something that I don’t have or can’t have?
When you do competitions, are you mostly competing also against drag kings?
Masculine Illusion NYC. When I went to nationals competing in Mr. Gay United States Masculine Illusion, that was the only time that I was competing with drag kings.
However, I was very surprised to see that there were far more trans men who wanted to compete in pageantry as opposed to drag kings. If that makes sense.
And so, if the category is called Masculine Illusion, these men are not performing an illusion. They are men.
And so, I was really shocked that this was how the category was shaking out. But they were happy.
I was not happy.
I hated how that went.
I also do pageantry. Which I think I’m one of the only kings in the city that not only does competitions but does pageantry.
What’s the difference between those?
Great question. A competition is smaller. A local group or organization puts it on. You can win a title like you’re the winner of that season of that competition. But a pageant is registered with a pageant system. They are more formal and competitive. People put more into these packages, I think. And they’re supposed to come with more prestige when you win.
Yeah.
I’m not going to talk shit about my…
You can if that’s what you so desire.
What usually would come is something like that.
It’s my responsibility to hold prelims for Mr. Gay United States NYC Masculine Illusion for next year. So, it’s my job to cast and find a guy to go fill this spot.
But it takes a lot of money and a lot of time and a lot of travel to compete in nationals. And I just don’t know any kings off the top of my head who I think would want to go.
Have you noticed the drag king performance scene change during the time that you’ve been in it?
No, I think that it’s stronger in New York City than in a lot of other cities. It was already strong when I showed up. One big change is we have the only drag king brunch in the city. And that’s in Queens.
And that was not here when I started. I run not only one but two of New York City’s only drag king bingos. As you already know.
I think that I’m so deeply imbued in this scene that if things are changing, my head’s underwater.
Have you seen much development with the drag thing…
There are very few drag things that I see consistently getting bookings that were not already.
If they already were… There are a handful that are doing super well and are really rising up in the ranks, which is awesome.
Do you have a favorite performance that you’ve ever done?
Not really.
Do you have a go-to performance song?
At the end of almost every show, I do Fat Bottom Girls.
Okay. And where do you get your costumes?
Most of them are made… I get them made for me. These pants were made by my drag wife, Liz B. N. I did Levi’s Pride campaign last summer and so this jacket was custom-made from Levi’s.
That embroidery is crazy.
Thank you.
It says my name on the back of the jacket.
It’s hand-embroidered.
I love this look. This is Leather Master, which is a leather shop in South Florida. I have a rhinestoner, and my rhinestoner made this.
What did your earliest costumes look like?
My earliest costumes were just dead-ass my own clothes. For my first show, I wore chinos, a brown belt, loafers, and a white shirt.
I don’t smoke cigarettes, but I rolled a pack of cigarettes up in the sleeve because I wanted to look like Marlon Brando.
Do you think that you have a pose that encapsulates Cunning?
A pose? Yeah. I do this inversion on people, where I sort of sit in their laps and then flip upside down and do a spread eagle.
I do that at most shows.
Okay, yeah. Your characteristic?
Yeah.
The drag queens, I get splits and heel claps. Very frequently. But do you do less… I’ve seen you do more acrobatic stuff as well.
Oh, I do, yeah, yeah, yeah.
What was your experience in performance before you did drag?
I did theater for 15 years. I did dance for a little while, but I was never very good at it.
Yeah, I’ve always been a theater person.
All right, high five!
Thank you so much.
Cool, sick!